Thursday, December 04, 2008

Acting White: Justice Thomas Considering Obama’s Claim To The White House

What is clear. The voting public selected Barack Obama and Joe Biden to become this country's leadership, come January 20, 2009. What is NOT clear. President-elect Obama’s meeting of the test of natural-born citizenship, thereby qualifying him, and providing uncontestable installation into the office as winner.

The US Supreme Court decided the 2000 election battle between Bush and Gore, and they may very well decide whether Obama ever moves into, or gets to stay in, the White House, not to mention the chaos this process would rain down on our already beleaguered country. Of note, Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas is considering the merits of one of the challenges, even as I write this. Then again, I am hard pressed to see officials from Hawaii, or the US State Department, standing up against the voters or Obama. I am also dubious of the US allowing officials or records of Pakistan or Indonesia to influence, through testimony, who sits in the Office of the President of the US.

The first issue is whether Obama’s original Hawaii birth certificate, as presented, is valid. While some argue that he was actually born in Kenya, rather than Hawaii, as his Kenyan grandmother testifies, this is not the substantive issue. Hawaii provides for its citizens to bear children outside of the country, within certain requirements. Upon return, the state will issue a birth certificate in exchange, resembling the one offered by the Obama camp on their website. The real issue would seem to be if his parent met the stated residency requirements for valid issuance. The discretion of the decision maker in this case, the Hawaii Director of Health, would seem to create significant latitude, making challenge very difficult, except if there was evidence that either of his parents had valid non-US passports at the time. This would evidence a problem with Hawaii’s issuance of Barack’s US certificate, which they claim as valid.

The Hawaii requirements are as follows… [§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child. (b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.

The second issue is whether Obama’s mother later relinquished her son’s US citizenship, as it seems she did her own, when she married an Indonesian and moved to that country, with Barack in-tow. Indonesia does not allow dual-citizenship, so any evidence of Barack's activity as a citizen of that country is also evidence that his current US status could only be naturalized, not natural-born, thereby disqualifying his presidential bid (under Article Two of the US Constitution).

Following this logic, Obama’s self-described trip to Pakistan in 1981 begs the question of what passport he used. Only the US State Department, the Pakistan government, and/or Indonesia can definitively say what requirements he must have met to enter/return to each country. Which State Department staffers are going to put themselves in the line of fire testifying about what the Pakistani’s or Indonesian’s were requiring, at the time Obama visited? I say probably none.

So in the end we come back to where we started, where concerns and evidence together have yet to meet the test of formal inquiry. Despite negative connotations associated with his name, his mixed-race, and affiliations, the discretion of the voters was that Obama should lead. Voters believed his words more than Senator McCain’s, so we need to get out of his way and let him do the job. We will know soon enough if Justice Thomas thinks this dog will hunt. Thomas will probably kick this one back, but then again he may see this as a chance to show just how long he can hold a grudge.

James C. Collier

Hat Tip: The Field Negro


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Anonymous said...

I didn't vote for him. He is not my leader.

Anonymous said...

Your old friend anonymous here ... I would argue that the voters didn't elect Obama so much as he was SOLD to them--or the less thoughtful among them--very deliberately and very aggressively, and not on the basis of any policy but purely on the basis of rhetoric and bullshit. You have to look at the money spent and the tactics used, and then ask yourself if that has anything to do with an informed and thoughtful decision-making process.

Is Obama a citizen? If not, the voters were cheated, don't you see? They were sold an item that they thought was suited for a job, when he doesn't (if this is so, and it probably is since his people are so cagey about it) meet the first qualification. If I sell you a car with bad emissions papers and then you discover it won't pass smog, is it my fault or yours? Moreover, if then you realize that the car only LOOKS better, but still runs as poorly and is as dangerous as your old car, man, won't you be upset.

Will any of this matter? Of course not. Republics (governments of laws)decline into democracies (governments of ever-changing public *opinion*) and democracies decline into despotism (think Nazi Germany and the man who was overwhelmingly popular, which allowed the laws to be put in the trash bin). That statement, without my interjections, is paraphrased from Aristotle, by the way.

So the public will be outraged about them trying to bring Obama into compliance with the most basic laws. But you have to remember, public opinion comes straight out of a box in the middle of the living room.

Anonymous said...

There is no question that fairness and justice should prevail. However When we should be focusing on economy, jobs, war and all the other problems we have at hand, this is a very obsurd way of wasting everyone’s time. It’s time to move on, look forward and not constantly question this guy's authenticity - not that he did not go through this enough times during his campaign.

Anonymous said...

There is no question that fairness and justice should prevail. However When we should be focusing on economy, jobs, war and all the other problems we have at hand, this is a very obsurd way of wasting everyone’s time. It’s time to move on, look forward and not constantly question this guy's authenticity - not that he did not go through this enough times during his campaign.

James C. Collier said...

S4O: To the contrary, I think events are unfolding as Obama expected and planned. If these event were inevitable (as I believe), he would much rather face a post-election defensible legal play, rather than a pre-election public opinion battle of his status.

Anonymous said...

Obama said of his Aunt who is apparently in this country illegally that if she is indeed here illegally she should have to follow our laws and return to her country, that we are a nation of laws.

Therefore if it is found to be true as set forth by our laws that
he is indeed not a citizen should he not have to be governed by those same laws he himself says his own Aunt should abide by?

I can understand the uproar but if it were anyone other than Obama the same ones that are denouncing a possible ruling against his presidency due to not being a citizen would be saying just the opposite.

A lot was involved with his win.
ACORN, untraceable credit card contributions, enough money to put Vote Obama offices in every battleground state.

And too the record shows that ABC, NBC, and CBS reported positively for Obama a much higher percentage of the time than they did for McCain.

Anyone see the "View" interviews with Obama and McCain?
Obama was compared to Brad Pitt and was constantly fawned over.
McCain caught pure hell.

With money, the media, and liberal hollywood on his side he couldn't lose. All the wrong reasons to actually win.............

A possible rulling against his citenzenship?

Bookworm Girl said...

how hard is it to just turn over one's birth certificate? game over.

James C. Collier said...

BG: Obama's campaign turned over said birth certificate, wherein it was pronounced a fraud, except by the state of HI. The denouncers took the missing information, hospital and delivery doctor, as evidence of fraud, which it is not. It just means he was born physically out of the country to parents who were residents of HI. Obama camp smartly remained mum.

Anonymous said...

" It just means he was born physically out of the country to parents who were residents of HI."

His mother was a resident, not his father. True?
A slip of the typewriter.....

Although I hope this issue can be settled without excessive conflict I would also hope that there is some concrete evidence to convince the skeptics.

This country doesn't need any more unsettling now.

In spite of how the election was won, which I don't agree with, it was won and the country needs to get down to the business of working on it's many problems.

On another note I just pray the people of this country will learn to actually KNOW the candidates instead of voting for some because of "change" and only change.

The exit polls interviews were so telling.
Obama voters thinking republicans were the house and senate majority.
Naturally with all the economic turmoil they wanted to blame who they mistakenly thought was in power and voted as such.

When a friend was asked what policies of Obama's made him want him as president he had not a clue but only repeated the standard,
"we need a change".

What a fine outstanding bunch of educated citizenry we have.

Most of the media shares a large part of the blame for that also, being in the democratic party pocket. The unfairness in reporting was downright sickening.

Anonymous said...

Wait a minute.....

Was he born in HI as said or not?
Why was the hospital and Dr. information missing if he was born in HI?

His mother was a resident of HI and father a resident of Kenya correct? Not both.....

James we hope you'd clear this up for us instead of making it even more confusing.

I'd have to ask you also, if there is no irrefutable proof he is a citizen should he be president and if McCain had been in the same situation would your opinion as stated in the opening of this blog still hold?

James C. Collier said...

Anon 6:24, Did you read my post? Some Obama relatives claim he was physically born on Kenyan soil, as McCain was born in Panama. Physical place of birth is irrelevant here. The decision to grant natural-born birth status is with discretion of the HI Health Director, based on residency of the parents. Obama Sr. colonialism muddled citizenship (where he is a Brit by colonial force, having never lived in the UK) may have been the reason the HI Director issued the certificate on strength of the mother. Again, the missing hospital and/or doctor is common to US certificates issued to those born overseas. He is a citizen by virtue of his HI validated certificate, period. If HI withdraws (and they won't) for some reason then the story changes.

Anonymous said...

The US is done. Stick a fork in her. Killed by the PC goons.


Anonymous said...

Hey dude call me what you will I can't make this stuff up.,7340,L-3586542,00.html

Anonymous said...

Yep, seems Mr. Collier is determined to be a cheerleader for this guy purely on the basis of skin color. I haven't heard a coherent defense of Obama's stated positions on anything--just the assertion that he's not president yet, so don't judge yet. Well, he's telegraphing, by way of his record, his rhetoric and the crew he's selected, that he intends to take us down the road to more war and deeper tyranny.

He hasn't provided irrefutable proof that he's eligible as a citizen to be president. Like everything else about him, the whole thing reeks of fraud and puppetry. But what the hell, he's got a nice tan. That'll be a change.

Anonymous said...

We can end this in a NY minute if Obama releases his real birth certificate. Obama is a fake, a manchurian candidate supported by the power elite to bring in the final stage of the world government, and everyone is so shocked that he is putting his war cabinet together.

Anonymous said...

I think anonymous = bitter. reading the overall comments he/she is trying to be the PC that he/she speaks against by talking about getting down to business - but if he/she were honest he/she would open his/her eyes and understand america's frustrations with the republican party and the W admin in particular. many also understood that mccain lacked judgment (as in his picking of palin and his embracing of joe the non licensed plummer to captain his campaign) for a black man to be elected in this nation - says a lot about the way many whites have felt about white leadership. their pocketbooks say it all.

talk about being cheated - psst. please. i don't think you want to EVEN go there.

In the words of that famous Evangelical Theologian Bob Seger, "Turn The Page."

Anonymous said...

There is only one Party in the US. Controlled by the wealthy. I voted for Ron Paul now I vote for revolution. Let the Civil War II begin. I am ready along with many of my brothers.

Anonymous said...

I think the biggest thing anyone is bitter about is how Obama can rise from the cesspool of Chicago politics (see Blagojvich) Ayers, Wright, Farrakahn, Rezco, etc. and it all be totally ignored by the major news medias. If McCain had evolved from the same type of background he would have been crucified by those exact same media.
It is the never ending double standard.
Yes none of the cesspool may have stuck to Obama and he may have risen through the mire honestly and without guilt but not one person can say they know this without a doubt.
But is there speculation by the media? Not a one.
And as said before if McCain had the same "issues" the speculation would be rampant and widespread.
The same ones calling for a fairness doctrine need it the most.

As far as the lawsuit it seems to have been put to rest and good riddance.

But now we have Blegojvich and the ever faithful corrupt Chicago political machine to consider....
OR ignore as the media will do since their savior Obama could have links to that same machine.

The "news" no longer exists.
It's now "lets edit the news to fit our interests" and to hell with the facts.

Anonymous said...

Many Americans didn't know the democrats were running the house and senate the last few years. They blamed the supposed republican house and senate for a lot of the economic issues when it should have been the democrats they were tired of such as Todd and Franks who ignored the banking issues that have come to roost.

The election was a farce by and large of uneducated uninformed "we need change" voters.
And of course the ninety plus percent that voted on race alone.
But it was of course "ok" this time.

Anonymous said...

Your blog entry begs for a few comments:
1) Obama's grandmother said something in an African language that could not be heard clearly in the tape. The translator, who was in on the plot to try to get her to say that Obama was born in Kenya, claimed she said that she was present at his birth. There is no way to tell if this was true.
2) The Hawaiian law about birth certificates to foreign-born children of legal residents is not unique. It is actually necessary to conform with US immigration laws. (I believe that foreign-born children of legal aliens are entitled to legal resident status if their parents had lived in the US for at least one year and so would need an official record of their birth, but I haven't been able to verify this.)
3) According to US law, parents canNOT renounce the citizenship of their children. Children, regardless of their age, must renounce their citizenship themselves. Therefore, Obama's mother could not have renounced his US citizenship.
4) There was no ban on travel to Pakistan using a US passport in 1981.
5) My real name is Jeff.

Anonymous said...

I'm much less upset about this than all the other things the Obamas hid about their lives before he got elected.

He campaigned under a shroud of secrecy and the media acted as if it were outrageously taboo to question anything about his past. Now we have a complete unknown in office, spearheading arguably the most radical agenda of the past 50 years with a rubber-stamp legislative majority.

What I learned from this election is that our politicians (both parties) think we're a bunch of gullible, uninformed hero-worshippers who care more about who a candidate is than what he or she intends to do. And they're right.